Extended Winter Camping

[shum]

This past week marked the longest we've been out in the rig in the winter at 7 days and 6 nights. The weather at MacGregor was with the exception of one day......cold! Think we probably had an average temp of around -7C/19F with the lowest approx around -12C/10F to a high of 0C/32F. It snowed every day I think with close to 6" of powder coming in off Lake Huron in daily snow squalls .

Being out this long in weather this cold did open my eyes to the thought of possibly covering our rig the next time we do this. With the cold the way it was and no sun for the entire week and snow coming every day we had quite a bit of ice forming on the gutters of the KZ and then coming over the gutters to form pretty good icicles down the side of the rig. By Saturday my street side front pas-thru door was inaccessible for the first time due to a massive amount of ice covering it. I worked on it for half an hour with the hairdryer to no avail. With the temps and wind what ice was melting soon froze again on the way down, could not overcome the cold. The curbside door did manage better and luckily I had access to the other side of the basement from the bunk house trap door. The hinge area of our man door was also taking a hit from all the freezing water coming down and by Sunday morning was becoming a real bear to keep clear of ice so we could open and close it properly.

Our rear queen slide out also had quite a bit of ice on the roof that had to be cleared prior to putting it back inside and that took me about 20 min's to remove. I do have a cover for this but became lazy last year because our longest stay was only four days and we had no issues. I will be putting it back on my list to install when we head up next time.

My furnace also picked a nice time to stop functioning properly on Saturday. I repeatedly tried to get it going but it would only run through it's three trys and then shut down, I think the sail fan is shot so that's on my list to replace asap. With this in mind I now had no way to heat the underbelly of my rig and was seriously worried with the extended cold that I may have an issue with the dump valves perhaps freezing on me. Luckily when I got the Flojet hooked up and gently pulled the remote valve all was good and the same with the gray tank! Whew! Obviously I've got to work on an electrical heating system for this area as a backup to the gas heated forced air system.

Speaking of Flojet macerators when I went to use mine on Sunday after having used it earlier in the week I found it frozen stuck! Some TP that I had not cleaned out froze solid in the impeler causing it to blow the fuse. I had to bring it inside and pour some hot water into the area containing the impeler and eventually freed it. Upon pulling the fuse to replace it, it broke inside the on/off switch and I was forced to pull it apart piece by piece with a set of pliers and then replace. What a PITA! I had learned last year to bring the hose inside to make sure it was defrosted and will have to do the same with the PC from now on.

BTW I had to make two trips to the dump station and was worried the hose may be froze before I returned and it almost was! Geeze Louise! Another couple minutes and I would have been back inside defrosting that as well!

Anyway we certainly learned some nice lessons about extended cold weather stays that had not occurred to me last season.

All though a little challenging I would not hesitate to head out again for a stay as long or longer than this

[High-Tech Redneck]

..... ,,,,I don't know if I should say,,,glad ya enjoyed some winter camping,,,,,or ,,,,are you crazy,, ,,,,no,,,I'm the same way about taking my boat out,,,I enjoy it no matter what type of weather,,,,I've sit in it through a many of down pours and cold,wet weather and some summers where you better not sit on anything metal,, ,,,,,the only advice I could possibly give you on your post,,,,is that I have one rule about TP,,,,,,It never goes in the toilet,,,,the DW's #1 TP goes in one walmart bag and then tied up,,,and the #2 TP goes in another walmart bag and instantly gets brought to the camp-sites trash-bin,,,,I know the camping TP says it dissolves in water and all,,,,and alot of people tell me they never had problems with it,,,,,I don't know if it's a problem or not,,,,I've always had this rule in all of my TT's,,,,it's just to easy to put it in a bag and not have to worry about having to clean it out.,,,,,,,,OH,,,,the low tomorrow is forcast to be 17-F to 21,,,,,and for the next 5 -6 days except for Thurs.,,,34-35 and forcast for a wintery mix on that day,,,,,I don't know about all this global warming crap,,,unless it's melting and running down here,,,

[shum]

I've never had issue with the TP in the sence that a lot of other people have where it clogs the system.
We use plenty of water and usually an additive as well. The PC does tend to do a real good job pumping/blending everything that heads it's way so it was my fault for not checking the impellers and clearing them after I was done BTW I do run the gray water from the shower after the black tank to clear the lines and Flojet

I also usually give it a good shot of WD40 after I'm done as but failed to do that as well.

And yes we are crazy

[cdnbayside]

Shum, could you leave the rear slide out extended while you're not there?

[another_newfie]

Our family joined in on the fun as well and enjoyed 6 nights of winter camping along with Shum and his clan. Even though ours was split into a 2 night and a 4 night trip. The first part of the trip was 2 nights and the weather was much warmer. The second part of the trip was in the much colder weather. Like Shum I learned some valuable lessons and will alter some methods.

The first incident was a frozen dump hose which split in half. I have been leaving my grey water valve wide open and letting all grey drain right into my tote. Works well in moderately cold weather, in very cold weather the water that gets trapped in the ribs of the hose freezes, and the cold itself makes the hose brittle. Solution, make a dump "hose" out of PVC. I'll get to that. The end result is that I split the hose in half, re-connect my bayonet adapters and left it. Mistake! The hose shifted and angled itself upward causing the grey to sit in the valve area where it froze solid. I was forced to dis-assemble my grey valve and thaw it. Note, using a heat gun, even on a low setting is a no no. It will melt things, don't ask me how I know. I resorted to the tried and true method of creating a tent out of a tarp and using a 1500W heater powered by the and a few hours later all was well. Putting it all back together, in the DARK, in about minus 14C was fun .

Given that fun I decided to dump the black and get it offloaded right away, since there was 4 adults and 1 child in the rig for 3 nights it was time. No big deal, that went fine. Except like Shum I quickly realized any rinse water freezes FAST at the dump station. Also thawing dump hoses inside was a non-starter, as DW would have none of that (can't blame her). This was another case of having my outside storage shelter was a god send. It enabled me to work on things out of the elements and I even ran a 1500W heater in there to warm the area.

I noticed while thawing my grey that one corner of my black tank heater had come off my tank as well. Now when I installed it I was a dumb dumb and I didn't clean the area as well as I should have. Now I will re-attach it with Eternabond on my next trip. However, with less than perfect contact of the heater I had a fear that the tank would not receive the heat it needed to keep the fluids from freezing. I was right, when on departure day I pull the trigger on the black and nothing released . Not really a big deal since I had dumped the night before. I will attach the heater properly, and heat the area under the rig to loosen things up on my next trip. Lesson learned here is that when these tank heaters are exposed in very cold weather they might not have enough grunt to keep the liquid from freezing.

I am also going to be installing heat tape on my valves as the insulation I had on them was all but useless in extreme temps. Nothing replaces heat!

On the plus side all the plumbing inside was perfect, no issues with freezing whatsoever.

Lastly, also like Shum my rear storage area door is right below a drain point for water and I battled keeping it available to me and ultimately lost. I was able to free it finally on departure day to store my chairs etc but I know on my next trip it will be a BEAR to get it open again.

Shum and I commented on the crazy aspect a few times, usually with a drink in our hand standing around a warm campfire though.

[shum]

Shum, could you leave the rear slide out extended while you're not there?

DW has suggested this but I'm not sold on the idea. I'm sure KZ did not have in mine to have this area extended for extended periods of time so I'm not to crazy about snow loads sitting on it for perhaps weeks at a time. Yes I know it's designed to handle upwards of 1200lbs of cargo but I'm not convinced the roof of it is designed to carry loads for an extended period of time.

There is a owner of another expandable unit up at Mac who has left his unit covered and out for the past two seasons but for the amount of minutes it takes to retract in and out I'll continue doing it.

[High-Tech Redneck]

Shum and I commented on the crazy aspect a few times, usually with a drink in our hand standing around a warm campfire though.

,,,,Will agree on the CRAZY ASPECT part,, ,,,,,,a campfire,drink and friends makes the end justify the means, ,,,,,,edit,,,,the main thing ,,,,,did ya new tires on the tote roll to the dump station without making alot of noise ,,,

[another_newfie]

,,,,Will agree on the CRAZY ASPECT part,, ,,,,,,a campfire,drink and friends makes the end justify the means, ,,,,,,edit,,,,the main thing ,,,,,did ya new tires on the tote roll to the dump station without making alot of noise ,,,

The tote performed perfectly as I expected. With the amount of snow we had the tires actually allowed it to travel much easier.

Here are some pictures if anyone is interested:

http://good-times.webshots.com/album/576178822iDuXMo?vhost=good-times

[Anml_341]

Shum said earlier in this posting "My furnace also picked a nice time to stop functioning properly on Saturday. I repeatedly tried to get it going but it would only run through it's three trys and then shut down, I think the sail fan is shot so that's on my list to replace asap."

I would offer the following suggestion: my guess is that you had frost on the sail switches... did you try using a hair dryer at the intake and exhaust ports and blow in warm air. Then retry the furnace. Do this three times before undertaking repairs. Also, try using the compressor to blow in air into each (intake and then exhaust - this will do two things: 1- remove any loose rust that may have accumulated, and 2- possibly defrost any sail switches.) This has worked for us on a number of occassions. Had I known you were having these problems, we have a hair dryer that has worked for us.

As for the ice build up, we know what you are talking about as we also had to learn the hardway. We have been recommending using a tarp for many years especially when you are using the rig over a period of time.

Toilet Paper: We stopped putting TP down our toilet after having the knife valve become plugged and then trying to unplug it. You only have to do that once before you make some changes. We put a waste basket beside the toilet and all TP goes into the container which is emptied each day. For us, that solved the problem.

I hope that when you are removing the build up of accumulated snow that we are still receiving that everyone is very careful so as to not damage any of the vent coverings or skylights on the roof as all that plastic can be very easily broken.

[High-Tech Redneck]

,,,,Will agree on the CRAZY ASPECT part,, ,,,,,,a campfire,drink and friends makes the end justify the means, ,,,,,,edit,,,,the main thing ,,,,,did ya new tires on the tote roll to the dump station without making alot of noise ,,,

The tote performed perfectly as I expected. With the amount of snow we had the tires actually allowed it to travel much easier.

Here are some pictures if anyone is interested:

http://good-times.webshots.com/album/576178822iDuXMo?vhost=good-times

,,,,,That storage shed is the only way to go for a long term site,,,,,you remove the snow from the roof mainly to keep the weight down ,,,,,,,,,,that snow can't survive around that campfire area,,,,nice set-up,,,,the pics show that it was possible to enjoy most of the trip,,,,,,,,but if ya just read the first post,,,,well,,lets just say,,it was plum scary to read for a warm blooded creature,,,